Episode 16 - Ben Interrupted (spoiler)

[Spartan83]

Now this is how you make an episode 👌

By borrowing the best parts from the original show i.e Shock theatre, star light star bright and Evil leaper story arc.

A great 10/10 episode which had jeopardy action heavy on the sci-fi elements and a kick-*** storyline.

[sna77]

eh, I hated it. The original show is a feel good show. This show is just loud and annoying.

[Spartan83]

Originally Posted by sna77

eh, I hated it. The original show is a feel good show. This show is just loud and annoying.

If you read my comments throughout the forum I agree with you 💯. This show is a pale imitation of the original.

However this episode was the best of a bad bunch.

[Spartan83]

The show in small parts has its positives. i like personally how they highlight the sci-fi more and do give us the viewer glimpses of modern QL HQ but it tries to push too many over arching storylines into one episode. EP16 had a revelation in every scene which wasn't needed, again the acting wasn't great or heartfelt.

Could be described as a tangled mess.

[Starbright]

I actually have a fair idea where the storyline might be going now - Martinez isn't evil, he never was but he feels he is doing what he *has* to do. He is military, trained to follow orders and get the job done and he knows Ziggy (is the Ziggy from the new series actually the original Ziggy or some kind of clone/recreation?

I've suspected we might be watching the birth of the "red" project since early on. It just made sense as a strong possibility.

I wasn't sure in salvation but after SOS and him leaping blue, I said either they got rid of the color-coding of red = evil leapers or he is part of
a not Lothos aligned project that has different goals. I can't really see Sam behind that level of ruthlessness but maybe Alia?

I'm not getting a Heroes vibe- I'm getting more terminator 2 here.

So let's see if I can figure out the original history here. So Ben leaps 5 years early with Addison as the original leaper. In the original time line Addison most likely is the leaper. At some point it is discovered that Ziggy has become Lothos or Lothos aligned Martinez knows that, he is from that future he doesn't know Addison personally. In his future Lothos-Ziggy is a major threat, and the evil project must be stopped at any cost. They don't have a Ziggy because they no longer trust such a computer is my guess.

Ben's real mission is to humanize the people from his project and tell Martinez they cam be allies and also to discover that it is thier project at risk of becoming evil leaper HQ.

Martinez's original mission was potentially to kill Addison because she was set to become the first agent of Lothos-Ziggy through no fault of her own. I'm going to guess that Ian and Martinez were either on the same desperate cpunter-measures team but had different beliefs about the right way to fix it or else were actually two very different paths to fix this mess that they hoped would come together - and I think they will.

I think our group now knows the truth because of this and now they have to figure out how in hell to get that knowledge to Ben without Ziggy knowing.

I think Martinez comes with orders to kill Addison/destroy Lothos-Ziggy and Addison is collateral damage which sets off a chain of events where there are people desperate to stop that as well- but because Martinez has now met Addison and Ben and our project now knows he is willing to stand down and become an ally in stopping Ziggy-Lothos.

So Sam Beckett where exactly do you fit in. - because you do.

And Ziggy if you became Lothos to force Daddy to come home - effective move bit totally not cool

[Spartan83]

I feel they don't need to complicate the Evil leaper origin, straight up story telling would suffice.

If they are going down the path of Ziggy being corrupted I would like to believe Ziggy fights back but inorder to do so he/she sheds the sub-program Lothos like a "skin of evil" ( a nod to ST next gen trekkies out there �� ).

They have already acknowledged the existence of the "evil leaper" project through the mis-filed report Ian found, I assume in that file it had names as shown by Zoe but also fedback by Sam and Al like Alia Thames and especially an A.I super computer called Lothos.

We are setting up a time travel paradox if they choose to do this which even in the original show with Sam they never found the origins of the evil QL project.

[McDuck]

Originally Posted by Spartan83

I feel they don't need to complicate the Evil leaper origin, straight up story telling would suffice.

If they are going down the path of Ziggy being corrupted I would like to believe Ziggy fights back but inorder to do so he/she sheds the sub-program Lothos like a "skin of evil" ( a nod to ST next gen trekkies out there �� ).

They have already acknowledged the existence of the "evil leaper" project through the mis-filed report Ian found, I assume in that file it had names as shown by Zoe but also fedback by Sam and Al like Alia Thames and especially an A.I super computer called Lothos.

We are setting up a time travel paradox if they choose to do this which even in the original show with Sam they never found the origins of the evil QL project.

Perhaps the “mis-filed” report is a form of Ziggy struggling against a Lothos corruption? They need to restore her voice and ego to fix things, I would think.

Side note—smashing Magic’s phone screen doesn’t make it not able to spy any longer. I was surprised they didn’t also move farther away from it or throw it half a block down.

[Spartan83]

Originally Posted by McDuck

Perhaps the “mis-filed” report is a form of Ziggy struggling against a Lothos corruption? They need to restore her voice and ego to fix things, I would think.

Side note—smashing Magic’s phone screen doesn’t make it not able to spy any longer. I was surprised they didn’t also move farther away from it or throw it half a block down.

So you mean Ziggy is trying to alert the team to a possible breach by the future version of itself by leaving a clue of evil leapers?..... a breadcrumb.

It's a little confusing as to what version of ziggy is operating at HQ and if it is being co-erced by its future version, that's were this show is heading. It is making my brain hurt though in terms of the original acknowledgement of the evil leapers, they were already known to Sam and especially Al and the original team, was that knowledge just buried and forgotten about? A villainous A.I super computer? LOL

It seems stupid that the program would restart without no prior knowledge of Sam and Als adventures, Magic knew his original history and death in vietnam so this would be a major plot hole if the others never knew about evil leapers etc.....this is what this show does well in retconning O.G Quantum Leap.

[McDuck]

Originally Posted by Spartan83

So you mean Ziggy is trying to alert the team to a possible breach by the future version of itself by leaving a clue of evil leapers?..... a breadcrumb.

Possibly... I have been confused the whole time as to why Ziggy doesn't speak. That was what made the parallel hybrid computer of the OG so unique, in part. That and "Barbra Streisand's ego" lol Ziggy has a lot more screens now and seems much more dependent on Ian and the rest of the IT team, plus loads of visible servers... So what changes were made and is it possible this is allowing for temporal links with other versions of Ziggy? Did they feel the need to tamp down the ego and make Ziggy more of a run of the mill supercomputer?

It's a little confusing as to what version of ziggy is operating at HQ and if it is being co-erced by its future version, that's were this show is heading. It is making my brain hurt though in terms of the original acknowledgement of the evil leapers, they were already known to Sam and especially Al and the original team, was that knowledge just buried and forgotten about? A villainous A.I super computer? LOL

The rest of the team beyond Magic seem only cursorily aware of the prior project. Like it was such a surprise to them about Al's ring, Janis' involvement. And so, yes, the shock/surprise about the "misfiled" Evil Leaper file (how would that have even happened) on the part of Ian and the confusion by Addison. Particularly since she was planning on Leaping.

It seems stupid that the program would restart without no prior knowledge of Sam and Als adventures, Magic knew his original history and death in vietnam so this would be a major plot hole if the others never knew about evil leapers etc.....this is what this show does well in retconning O.G Quantum Leap.

Magic's line to Janis about swearing to Al that no other Leapers would be stranded. I really want to know how involved/instrumental Al was in resurrecting PQL. Also--what are the other 3 sisters up to?

Lots of question marks.

[Spartan83]

Originally Posted by McDuck

Possibly... I have been confused the whole time as to why Ziggy doesn't speak. That was what made the parallel hybrid computer of the OG so unique, in part. That and "Barbra Streisand's ego" lol Ziggy has a lot more screens now and seems much more dependent on Ian and the rest of the IT team, plus loads of visible servers... So what changes were made and is it possible this is allowing for temporal links with other versions of Ziggy? Did they feel the need to tamp down the ego and make Ziggy more of a run of the mill supercomputer?

This is exactly why this series divides opinion, overlooking such vital elements of what made the original, this Ziggy 2.0 bears no resemblance to O.G Ziggy who by the way was more powerful. It is now just considered as a quantum super computer which deciphers code nothing more :-(

The rest of the team beyond Magic seem only cursorily aware of the prior project. Like it was such a surprise to them about Al's ring, Janis' involvement. And so, yes, the shock/surprise about the "misfiled" Evil Leaper file (how would that have even happened) on the part of Ian and the confusion by Addison. Particularly since she was planning on Leaping.

Its conceivable in government secret projects they only release need to know info and maybe bury the "dark" sections i.e Evil Leapers. We saw in the first episode addison explaining Sam and the whole project background to Ben brilliantly, so i assume if they knew the man they knew the program too. I have to say though its a long way away from when the series relaunched when the premise was for the new team to restart the program understanding the mysteries behind the machine and also its CREATOR....unfortunately none of that has been done, they appear to be all caught up with the tech......the only mystery is the Why when and where for Ben leaping LOL

Magic's line to Janis about swearing to Al that no other Leapers would be stranded. I really want to know how involved/instrumental Al was in resurrecting PQL. Also--what are the other 3 sisters up to?

Lots of question marks.

Which makes the passing of Dean even more sad, can you imagine how the show would have been like if Al was still around......also his other 3 daughters, Donna Eleese, Sammi Jo and also Tom Beckett.

I'm guessing one of those legacy characters will make an appearance in the finale leading us into season 2, tbh its abit of a shock Magic hasn't already met with Tom, but can you imagine having both Janis and Sammi Jo working together to find Sam and bring him home.

Excellent.

[McDuck]

Originally Posted by Spartan83

This is exactly why this series divides opinion, overlooking such vital elements of what made the original, this Ziggy 2.0 bears no resemblance to O.G Ziggy who by the way was more powerful. It is now just considered as a quantum super computer which deciphers code nothing more :-(

Exactly!!! Something has been done to Ziggy and it came at the cost of what made Ziggy unique and yes, far more powerful.

Its conceivable in government secret projects they only release need to know info and maybe bury the "dark" sections i.e Evil Leapers. We saw in the first episode addison explaining Sam and the whole project background to Ben brilliantly, so i assume if they knew the man they knew the program too.

Which again makes me think Ziggy had something to do with the "misfiling" making it available for Ian to find. It was heavily redacted, although the important parts (Sam, Al, Zoey, hologram) were there.

And, there seemed to be minimal issues with Zoey and Thames switching roles as the hologram, and they seem to have minimal issues switching holograms at New PQL... things that make you go hmmmm......

I have to say though its a long way away from when the series relaunched when the premise was for the new team to restart the program understanding the mysteries behind the machine and also its CREATOR....unfortunately none of that has been done, they appear to be all caught up with the tech......the only mystery is the Why when and where for Ben leaping LOL

Yes, that and missed opportunities for some HEART callbacks to the original. I'm still butthurt about them cutting the scene Susan Diol mentioned in an interview of Beth speaking to Al's spirit while working on the car in Ep2.

Which makes the passing of Dean even more sad, can you imagine how the show would have been like if Al was still around......also his other 3 daughters, Donna Eleese, Sammi Jo and also Tom Beckett.

It makes me so sad and mad that they waited so long to bring QL back and get a greenlight on this. My daughter and I have been watching NCIS: New Orleans, and Dean seemed frail in the episode he guested in. His stroke was a couple years after that and he had to retire from acting as a result. It is indeed very sad!

I'm guessing one of those legacy characters will make an appearance in the finale leading us into season 2, tbh its abit of a shock Magic hasn't already met with Tom, but can you imagine having both Janis and Sammi Jo working together to find Sam and bring him home.

Excellent.

I hope so. I really hope that they can get Teri Hatcher this time if they bring Donna back! Is Melora Hardin doing anything currently? Wonder if she would be interested in playing Sammi Jo.... So many missed opportunities, IMO.

[Spartan83]

Originally Posted by McDuck

Exactly!!! Something has been done to Ziggy and it came at the cost of what made Ziggy unique and yes, far more powerful.

But is Ziggy doing it itself or doesn't it need a programmer inorder to load up code for Ziggy to compute?

Which again makes me think Ziggy had something to do with the "misfiling" making it available for Ian to find. It was heavily redacted, although the important parts (Sam, Al, Zoey, hologram) were there.

I dunno what version of corrupted Ziggy we have, EP16 ended with red lights flashing but the synopsis for episode 17 says Ben will have to figure his next leap all out without Ziggys help......I'm assuming taking him offline

And, there seemed to be minimal issues with Zoey and Thames switching roles as the hologram, and they seem to have minimal issues switching holograms at New PQL... things that make you go hmmmm......

You could be right, or it could just be because we are set 20 years ahead in QL 2022 and they have made enhancements in linking nueons and maisons according to new Quantum theory and software code. I mean this is the confusing aspect of it, original Evil leaper project was supposed to be set 20 years in the future from PQL was i.e 1999 to 2020 which makes sense of an internal mole and a corrupted ziggy in todays version.
Martinez being an older version looks to be from the future again approx another 20 years going by his older appearance. It's another future version QL circa 2040s.....its just too confusing ..... we were never told of evil leapers origins in the original QL but it makes sense it would originate from inside QL 2022 project in L.A.

Yes, that and missed opportunities for some HEART callbacks to the original. I'm still butthurt about them cutting the scene Susan Diol mentioned in an interview of Beth speaking to Al's spirit while working on the car in Ep2.

Although a great idea to see that perhaps it was way too soon in this versions QL to have such a poignant scene?

It makes me so sad and mad that they waited so long to bring QL back and get a greenlight on this. My daughter and I have been watching NCIS: New Orleans, and Dean seemed frail in the episode he guested in. His stroke was a couple years after that and he had to retire from acting as a result. It is indeed very sad!

.

Very sad and incredibly insensitive as the fans wanted it to return while Dean was alive, the producers knew this :-(. They have never fully made a heartfelt tribute to Al in the show, just a throwaway comment with Jenn and Magic and mere mentions of Al between Beth and Magic talking.

I hope so. I really hope that they can get Teri Hatcher this time if they bring Donna back! Is Melora Hardin doing anything currently? Wonder if she would be interested in playing Sammi Jo.... So many missed opportunities, IMO.

That would be a huge scoop they would have to do something big like that in getting Terri Hatcher in Season 2. I think Melora Hardin played Abigail who ia Sammy Joes mum in the show.

Once they wrap up Ben saving Addison they could focus on Donna and Sammi Jo working to find and bring back Sam, side note the dynamic between Donna and Sammi Jo would be interesting as Sammi Jo doesn't know she is Sams daughter and of course Donna is NOT Sammi Jo's mum.....awkward lol Sam getting his leaping jollies and Sammi being his kid lol.

[Starbright]

I like the idea of Ziggy fighting back against something trying to make her evil. I liked her as a charactor. And I don't really want her to have turned of her own will.

That brings me back to is this really our Ziggy? That Ziggy was linked to Sam and Al, did they make a dire mistake changing that, suppress important pieces of who she is to make it possible?

I like that showing those files could be some part of Ziggy trying to help and fight back.

In this episode Ben made a mistake, the same mistake Sam once made - he ended up under truth serum telling people all about the project and just like with Sam, hints of the red project are right after - I don't think its chance.

I have another scenario - Sam has vanished and then Al dies. Ziggy who cares deeply for both of them is mourning and in that time of vulnerability either Trojan horse code or else Lothos is able to tempt or trick Ziggy. Ziggy knows she made a mistake but it's to late she has been infected. Maybe she even had it under control till more things were done to her code.

Let's see Ben added a program, Janis and Ian were fighting over Ziggy.

Then there is the "window" mentioned in the first ep of the new series. Window to catch Martinez's trail for our 3 chances? Window before something else happens at the project. Window to get on a trajectory to get to the moment to save Addison? Window for what?

Last week Jenn was the hologram this week she was out sick. Did the actress have a conflict or was actually out sick for real (Covid isolation?) - or is this actually a plot point?

Ian is pulling double duty as computers and security at this exact time also - related to Jenn being sent home sick by Magic.

That could be contrived or very clever writing - time will tell.

I do wonder in the timeline future Ian comes from was the Ziggy goes red thing sudden or a slow revelation - is future Martinez due to attack within weeks of project present? Or is Ben jumping to an actual future?

I want to know who Martinez's hologram is if he has one - is he in active contact with an HQ? I can't see Sam himself ordering someone to be that ruthless unless he changed a lot but just how many of our missing people are connected to this other project?

So how on earth do they clue in Ben as to what is going on - they have to fully jog his memory and the only way I see to this is to make the extremely risky move of confiding in present Martinez or contacting future Ian to get him to say something very specific to Ben which while a similar code word or whatever is said to future Martinez to say we are allies let's fix this stuff - because evil Ziggy can not know.

For Sam - Scott deserves a major role and I hope he it happens - he is alive to do it and very much an incredible actor. Dean is gone which makes me very sad and after the stroke he could no longer have done it even a few years ago - for Al is his family open to a bit of digital wizardry to give Al the send off he deserves? I don't know - and can they pull it off. I want one touching beautiful scene at least.

I have a kinda crazy idea that Al knowing that his time physically on earth was running out choose to let his life end by becoming a ghost in time in some way. If he knows what Sam did for him then he knows his family never existed before but he also wants all the good Sam did, may have found out about future risk or otherwise felt the need to make things right for Sam.

Have him be in the time stream - trying to help and occasionally leaping. Or perhaps uploaded into a computer? Somewhere that they can have him there at least one last time in some pivotal moment and we can have some kind of send off that truely honors Al and Dean - because I don't know how we tell the flashback story I want to see otherwise. We could try seeing young Janis with her father or meetings with Magic - all sorts of things but it's harder to pull off well.






I also want to know how involved Al was in the revival project? It almost feels like there may have been two phases to the relaunch. Al and Magic were involved early on but it seems like none of the newer people met Al?

[Starbright]

What about Kimberly Cullum she was the actual Sami Jo and young Abigail - I'd totally take her as Sami Jo also.

And it is really bothering me that we have not seen Tom at all. Magic *knows* him. It has me wondering if somehow there was another project in the middle.

Also I know Martinez is a common name but it was Tina's as well.

I so badly want those flashback seens with Al and Magic, Al and Tom, Al and Beth - Al and his daughter/s, Al and Donna, Al and Sami Jo, Al and Ziggy. With Dean gone - we are unlikely to get them. Maybe a book to show the alternate life for him we never got to see.

I can think of a few things - that can more easily be pulled off- a leap that involves Ben meeting a young Al or Trudy. They just need a really talented young Actor to be Al at an age far earlier then we met him.

More things that are easier to pull off -Young Janice listening to a phone call about the project while hidden so you don't really see Al clearly but you can hear him- using prior things of Al's voice, newspaper clippings, files.

The thing is we aren't going to see the loving father with his daughter, man with the heart of gold beneath any facade that Al had, all you can have is scenes where he is a distant figure using those methods.

The only way you get Al as a loving father, a good husband, a true friend - is if they have the budget to not only restore/upgrade the lost ending but go further and use deep fake type tech to let Dean appear as Al at least twice - once for the family he loves to really show what did with the gift he was given and - at somepoint a final moment with Sam. I can think of several versions of a touching final moment with Sam.

I wonder does Janis know she is a time alteration? Does anyone Know that Sam and Al both had aspects of thier own lives changed. Magic knows about Tom and himself - but if they don't know about the evil leapers prior to now - do they litterally not know about a lot of other things we do?

What about Sam's sister Katie. Sam has a fair amount of family, Al's family isn't connected with them? Any of them?

Where is Alia (young or older version),@-? Zoey? Thames? the odds of them at least being kids at this point is fairly high.

Did anyone get a close look at Addison's mother- is she an Easter egg?

What about any of the other original project staff? No kids that grew up with Janis?

Finally why this order of leaps and those three places to meet up with Martinez?

We're the leaps crafted to help Ben remember what he needed to remember before meeting Martinez? The first is Salvation a town that is so wonderful it is a fantasy - I enjoyed the ep but I don't get its purpose unless it's to give them both an "anchor" against personal non-existance way back in time - the same anchor? Sam's furthered back was the Civil War- not sure off the top of my head how close Salvation is to that time - but three distant past time anchors sounds like as good a reason as any.

Then a ship with Addison's father - he didn't even try to meet Addison's father so I doubt she was the deliberate target to kill.

The third is the moment Ben slips up and gives his data under truth serum- wonder if *that* is what Martinez needed to stop- did Addison reveal far worse in that same situation?

Who gave Martinez that order - because from the loom on his face he knows Ziggy is red , and his project needs people able to be a Ziggy alternate - he is poised to want to recruit rather then kill Addison except that he stabbed Ben.

I'm not sure I'd any of this even makes sense but I tried - I can see a bunch of puzzle pieces fitting together its just so hard to explain.

[Starbright]

What about Kimberly Cullum she was the actual Sami Jo and young Abigail - I'd totally take her as Sami Jo also.

And it is really bothering me that we have not seen Tom at all. Magic *knows* him. It has me wondering if somehow there was another project in the middle.

Also I know Martinez is a common name but it was Tina's as well.

I so badly want those flashback seens with Al and Magic, Al and Tom, Al and Beth - Al and his daughter/s, Al and Donna, Al and Sami Jo, Al and Ziggy. With Dean gone - we are unlikely to get them. Maybe a book to show the alternate life for him we never got to see.

I can think of a few things - that can more easily be pulled off- a leap that involves Ben meeting a young Al or Trudy. They just need a really talented young Actor to be Al at an age far earlier then we met him.

More things that are easier to pull off -Young Janice listening to a phone call about the project while hidden so you don't really see Al clearly but you can hear him- using prior things of Al's voice, newspaper clippings, files.

The thing is we aren't going to see the loving father with his daughter, man with the heart of gold beneath any facade that Al had, all you can have is scenes where he is a distant figure using those methods.

The only way you get Al as a loving father, a good husband, a true friend - is if they have the budget to not only restore/upgrade the lost ending but go further and use deep fake type tech to let Dean appear as Al at least twice - once for the family he loves to really show what did with the gift he was given and - at somepoint a final moment with Sam. I can think of several versions of a touching final moment with Sam.

I wonder does Janis know she is a time alteration? Does anyone Know that Sam and Al both had aspects of thier own lives changed. Magic knows about Tom and himself - but if they don't know about the evil leapers prior to now - do they litterally not know about a lot of other things we do?

What about Sam's sister Katie. Sam has a fair amount of family, Al's family isn't connected with them? Any of them?

Where is Alia (young or older version),@-? Zoey? Thames? the odds of them at least being kids at this point is fairly high.

Did anyone get a close look at Addison's mother- is she an Easter egg?

What about any of the other original project staff? No kids that grew up with Janis?

Finally why this order of leaps and those three places to meet up with Martinez?

We're the leaps crafted to help Ben remember what he needed to remember before meeting Martinez? The first is Salvation a town that is so wonderful it is a fantasy - I enjoyed the ep but I don't get its purpose unless it's to give them both an "anchor" against personal non-existance way back in time - the same anchor? Sam's furthered back was the Civil War- not sure off the top of my head how close Salvation is to that time - but three distant past time anchors sounds like as good a reason as any.

Then a ship with Addison's father - he didn't even try to meet Addison's father so I doubt she was the deliberate target to kill.

The third is the moment Ben slips up and gives his data under truth serum- wonder if *that* is what Martinez needed to stop- did Addison reveal far worse in that same situation?

Who gave Martinez that order - because from the loom on his face he knows Ziggy is red , and his project needs people able to be a Ziggy alternate - he is poised to want to recruit rather then kill Addison except that he stabbed Ben.

I'm not sure I'd any of this even makes sense but I tried - I can see a bunch of puzzle pieces fitting together its just so hard to explain.[/quote]

[Dman176]

Originally Posted by Starbright

Last week Jenn was the hologram this week she was out sick. Did the actress have a conflict or was actually out sick for real (Covid isolation?) - or is this actually a plot point?

Haven’t had a chance to comment all that much lately since I’ve been doing my own YouTube reviews of every episode, but I did want to clarify that Nanrisa did have COVID, which was why she was absent in this episode. In fact, she got it during shooting of 115, and there was a stand-in used in some scenes.

[NewFederalist]

I didn't think this episode was all that great. Average with a chance of C+. Too bad the actress who plays Jenn was unavailable. I find her to be the shining light in the series. Ernie Hudson just seems flat to me. He will forever be immortalized for exhaling a lung full of smoke through his nose in Ghostbusters and remarking "that's a big Twinkie"!