JUST A THEORY
I think it might be Sam. Especially after the time traveller expressed his displeasure at Ben Song for "following him".
~Steve
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The mysterious leaper
- Thread starter RossBeckett
- Start date
I think it might be Sam. Especially after the time traveller expressed his displeasure at Ben Song for "following him".
~Steve
I think its a nod to the Evil Leaper story from the original show, because those characters were much more unhinged than either Sam or Ben.
Theory
Hello I am new. But this is my take hope that it's ok to post.
I don't think the second leaper can't be Sam. In the pilot they say they project was cancelled 30 years ago. By what we have been shown we must assume Sam has been alone without a hologram during that time and has no way to learn about what has been going on with the project. Ben only recently leaped so there is no logical way for Sam to have this information UNLESS he has leaped to the future (and that was supposed to be possible in season 6 but has not been shown so not sure as to canon.) to learn about Ben that way and what's happening with the project or he now has a new hologram...maybe that is Janice with the her imaging chamber and using the original Handlink and her dad's genetic link to connect to Sam.
If they do a version of Sam that has met Ben before (in a previous leap) this show would need to address how Sam's Swiss cheese brain works (in this show). In the original he forgot almost everything from leap to leap except what was needed for that leap, like that he was married or knew martial arts. It seems (and I could be wrong it's only 5 episodes so far) the new one is going more in a direction of Ben keeping the memories he regains.) If they change canon and Sam regained his memory like that it could still work, but they need to explain that years of leaping caused him to retain more memories. Or it could be that in this one leap he remembers Ben through the Swiss Cheese. I still think regardless if it's evil leaper or Sam we should see them touch and and the aura destabilize showing who it is. The person could easily recognize Ben in another body if they are going the route of the episode "Return of the Evil Leaper" where they knew it was Sam without seeing him/seeing Arnold, because they heard him talking to Al. That would call back to the original.
Hello I am new. But this is my take hope that it's ok to post.
I don't think the second leaper can't be Sam. In the pilot they say they project was cancelled 30 years ago. By what we have been shown we must assume Sam has been alone without a hologram during that time and has no way to learn about what has been going on with the project. Ben only recently leaped so there is no logical way for Sam to have this information UNLESS he has leaped to the future (and that was supposed to be possible in season 6 but has not been shown so not sure as to canon.) to learn about Ben that way and what's happening with the project or he now has a new hologram...maybe that is Janice with the her imaging chamber and using the original Handlink and her dad's genetic link to connect to Sam.
If they do a version of Sam that has met Ben before (in a previous leap) this show would need to address how Sam's Swiss cheese brain works (in this show). In the original he forgot almost everything from leap to leap except what was needed for that leap, like that he was married or knew martial arts. It seems (and I could be wrong it's only 5 episodes so far) the new one is going more in a direction of Ben keeping the memories he regains.) If they change canon and Sam regained his memory like that it could still work, but they need to explain that years of leaping caused him to retain more memories. Or it could be that in this one leap he remembers Ben through the Swiss Cheese. I still think regardless if it's evil leaper or Sam we should see them touch and and the aura destabilize showing who it is. The person could easily recognize Ben in another body if they are going the route of the episode "Return of the Evil Leaper" where they knew it was Sam without seeing him/seeing Arnold, because they heard him talking to Al. That would call back to the original.
I had that thought, too, but I'm afraid it's more the evil leaper idea, as Moviefan2k4 suggests, because of the attitude of the leaper. I don't think Sam would have been so confrontational.
Perhaps Sam is suffering from some form of "leaper fatigue" from 30 years of do-gooding with no restbite but more than likely it's Evil QL related.
I think the Leaper was too aggressive to be Sam. If we have to have Evil Leaper connections... I'm going with Alia. She's a free agent, disconnected from both the ELP and QLP. I could see her being a gray-area Leaper; not changing things for bad, but being willing to go to extremes to change things for the better (ie: she'd have just shot Josiah instead of coming up with an elaborate trap like Ben did).
I can see where she'd be annoyed by someone following her through time, because she's gotta still be at least a little bit paranoid that Lothos will find her at some point.
As for how she knows about Ben? Well, I've always figured when she Leaped out at the end of the EL arc, she went to Al's Place. And then from there did her own thing as a Leaper. So she could know about Ben from the Bartender.
OR, this is Ben's first encounter with this Leaper, but it isn't this Leaper's first encounter with Ben!
I can see where she'd be annoyed by someone following her through time, because she's gotta still be at least a little bit paranoid that Lothos will find her at some point.
As for how she knows about Ben? Well, I've always figured when she Leaped out at the end of the EL arc, she went to Al's Place. And then from there did her own thing as a Leaper. So she could know about Ben from the Bartender.
OR, this is Ben's first encounter with this Leaper, but it isn't this Leaper's first encounter with Ben!
I'm ok with updating the QL mythos of how quantum accelerators work, the inputting of new code into Ziggys systems and how an old handlink can suddenly spook the QL project into panic but don't Leapers have to touch to see eachother for who they really are??
The mysterious leaper knew of Ben before even touching him.
First we had the no "waiting rooms" of the new QL project explained by the jargon about quantum entanglement, then leaping beyond one's lifetime with the new code so I hope they address how leapers can now see eachother without no "magnetic convergance" due to touching taking place.
The mysterious leaper knew of Ben before even touching him.
First we had the no "waiting rooms" of the new QL project explained by the jargon about quantum entanglement, then leaping beyond one's lifetime with the new code so I hope they address how leapers can now see eachother without no "magnetic convergance" due to touching taking place.
That's what I'm saying. Sam saw in the bar mirror, a leaper and also could see Stawpah. EL tech might be designed specifically to hide from Sam.
As to this leaper, we never saw him until after he touched Ben. So we don't know what he might have looked like, had Ben seen him before.
When was that mentioned? I don’t remember ever hearing them talk about the waiting room.
If I remember correctly it was mentioned in episode 1 but I watched an explanation of it below
https://youtube.com/shorts/tbfXzRCq4Es?feature=share
C'mon man look again, watch at the 26:50 min mark and you can see the mysterious leaper sitting at the table drinking beer watching Ben pass by him, he looked somewhat alarmed and seems as though he knew it was Ben.
He then went on to confronting Ben at the end.
Well Al did confirm to Sam in the "Revenge" episode that Ziggy did a scan in the prison and she could pick up "another leaper" i.e Zoey. All in all i think EL tech is designed to leap through time normally and not shield from other leapers although it is implied their tech is heavily more advanced i.e leaping to specific points in time and higher rates of retrieval.
I think seeing Stawpah and other leapers was more to do with the setting at Als Bar, playing tricks on the mind or seeing what the leaper wants to see. There are examples in the series where Lothos or Ziggy could / could not scan for the leapers so it's a little ambiguous.
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So, my big specific issue so far is that there is a physical body missing. They always said that he “vanished”, but we find out later that Sam’s body was in the waiting room. They’ve left that out in the reboot, and Magic says he doesn’t remember the time Sam kept into him, but maybe people blackout when they leap into Sam in the waiting room.
But that doesn't mean it's what Ben was seeing.
The fair assumption is they learned how to detect that presence between the first encounter and the next one.
It's difficult to ascertain what Ben can see at this early stage of the series as he still has Swiss cheese memory gaps but one thing is clear ....Mysterious leaper knows its Ben without touch.
Evil QL never knew about Sam , reference episode "Deliver Us From Evil" on Alia and Sams first encounter when Zoe appears she is equally shocked at the discovery of "another" Leaper saying " you mustn't tell him anything about us because we don't know anything about him".
Assuming evil QL made any significant upgrades in detection they were still bested by Ziggy at the climax of "Revenge" when Sam was on the run and Ziggy was blocking Lothos S&L as confirmed by Thames.
Sam could see Stawpah dude because stawpah was himself and he had not leapt into anyone else.
Alia was Connie and Sam was Jimmy.
Yeah those supposed upgrades didn't amount to much in the end as Lothos couldn't locate Sam during the episode as Alia was hypnotised and the electric fence forcefield of the prison was shielding Sam also.
It all became apparent when Zoe and Sam touched towards the end of the episode and then Lothos was zeroing on Sams leapee Liz Tate.
Evil QL tech was not assumed better at shielding their leapers as on 2 occasions Ziggy had accounted for leapers when scanning.
Ziggy for the win.
Nothing there about Evil QL being any better at hiding their leapers. Or improving.
I quoted you talking about Ziggy and Al detecting them later, and said the assumption was that "they" meaning Ziggy/Al may have gotten better at detecting the other leapers after the first encounter.
Either way, it's clear to me now that Evil QL wouldn't be hiding from stuff/ppl they do don't know anything about. As in, Sam. So the whole idea is moot.
That's right, as I said from the beginning, evil QL does not shield from Sam specifically at any point in their encounters.
I thought for a moment that this leaper could be Sam as well, but he sounded too hostile, and tonight's episode has identified him as a new character, still a leaper-to-be in Ben's present, it seems.
A relation to the evil leapers is plausible but I'm not a fan of the notion even though I had grown somewhat fond of the evil leapers but whatever the case I am worried about what this is.
With the project, the leaps and the Janice side plot I feel like this is unnecessary and distasteful clutter.
A relation to the evil leapers is plausible but I'm not a fan of the notion even though I had grown somewhat fond of the evil leapers but whatever the case I am worried about what this is.
With the project, the leaps and the Janice side plot I feel like this is unnecessary and distasteful clutter.
This new episode still left so many questions regarding Leaper X, realistically it couldnt' be solved in a day so they left it open to revisit down the line.
The original Evil leapers were always ambiguous but not new to QL. One thing that bugged me was didn't the new QL team read the saved files by the original team of Sam's Leaps ? Surely an entry of the Evil organisation and the evil AI unit L.O.T.H.O.S was logged and Magic and Jen would have been aware of them.
The original Evil leapers were always ambiguous but not new to QL. One thing that bugged me was didn't the new QL team read the saved files by the original team of Sam's Leaps ? Surely an entry of the Evil organisation and the evil AI unit L.O.T.H.O.S was logged and Magic and Jen would have been aware of them.
I would think so despite that all the information that had been accumulated was a couple of first names and the name of their AI and that based on evidence the evil project didn't even exist at the time.
The best explanation I can come up with for how the evil leapers are not in the records is that the original project didn't place as much significance on Sam encountering another leaper as this team is, which is a bit understandable since Leaper X/Martinez unlike Alia directly called Ben out by his real name.
See this is one reason the original would have benefited from more time spent on the project's end. We never have any idea how the rest of the team had regarded the evil leapers.
The only example I can think of in relation to the QL team logging records of leaps is the example of Magic, if you recall the discussion with Ian on the bench.
Ian asked Magic what was his original history and Magic answered he was K.I.A. I guess he would only know that if the QL team had logged a file of Sam's leap.
It's safe to say the old Ziggy would have detailed files/records of Sam's encounters I.e Down syndrome Jimmy x 2 where Al kept saying "in the original history Jimmy and Connie blah blah blah". Do you remember "Honeymoon Express" where Al reels off to the committee examples of Sam leaps ( I assume were recorded). I'm sure an encounter with a sinister organisation that would have been trying to kill Sam through time would surely have been recorded too.
That's why I was a little surprised a name wasn't referenced from the old specs of project QL files when they mothballed the project and rebuilt it in L.A.
A shame that 6th season never explored further the Evil QL project.