I just realised something. This is the first time that Sam has leapt overseas, what one would assume is a great feat. Since at the time of his leap he was so fixated with trying to save Tom, one might think that he actually willed himself there...
Ladystoneheart said:Did I get it right from the episode? So Sam's brother dies in a rescue mission for Al and the other prisoners in the original history?
Ladystoneheart said:The scene just killed me when it was shown that Al was on the photo. Maggie wins a Pulitzer for this shot so is Al still considered to be MIA then?
I am sorry for all these questions,first time viewer
It is my belief and the final scene of the episode confirms this that had Sam known he would have distributed equal importance to both his brother and best friend.
Agreed, and I think that is exactly why Al didn't tell Sam. He knew it would be a terrible (and really impossible) decision for Sam to have to make, so he chose to not put him in the position of having to choose between his brother or his friend (and instead made the decision for him).
Reminds me of the final line of the final verse of the Dixie Chicks song 'Traveling Solider'.
"One name read and nobody really cared, but a pretty little girl with a bow in her hair."
:'(
Look it up, it's a really well written song with a very Al and Beth theme.
Let's talk about Sam's selfishness here. Believe it or not I've come to appreciate this because it gives an otherwise too perfect character a sense of realism which makes him human and believable.
Here we have that selfishness almost invalidated by the fact that Ziggy doesn't seem to know what he should be doing having made multiple fruitless suggestions from ensuring the success of the unknown mission which turned into the POW rescue to saving Deek from the sapper attack. Which brings me to my next point.
Consider how the first part ended, the nature of Sam's leap out of the Basketball game; his hand reaching out for his brother, yelling his name in desperation to save him only to land him in the exact position to do so. Now add to our brainstorm soup when Al the Bartender reveals that Sam can take control of his leaps in Mirror Image. Something which it's implied that he has actually unconsciously done in many episodes but for obvious reasons I'm going to stick to Vietnam here.
My theory which came to mind watching it just yesterday and combines all the above ingredients together quite nicely (wow lol, all that Food Network I've been watching suddenly took over there XD), is that perhaps a task could not be determined because this was a leap of Sam's choosing not GTFW's. Still though as Al pointed out in the first part Sam isn't able to change what isn't supposed to be changed. So there is another factor at play here that allowed his success. Either Tom's death coincidentally happened to be considered a wrong or Sam was being given an exception, perhaps because of the difficulty of the previous leap.
That does make his success with Beth at the end of Mirror Image difficult to decipher however. Was this another exception? Why? Or was it a wrong that Sam didn't succeed the first time? That's another subject though.
Not exactly. The rescue mission had been unsuccessful in both timelines. What Maggie's photograph changed was that it sentenced Al to two more years as a POW. Is my information right? He'd originally been repatriated in '73 (stated in MIA) but then at the end of this episode which takes place in '70 he said five years which makes it '75. So the difference would be two years. Anyway how it did so isn't clear but the novel Pulitzer offers an amazing explanation to make that connection, I highly recommend it.
The point that was trying to be made is that right and wrong are concepts made up by humans. So what Sam needs to change ultimately depends on his own belief about what is right and wrong. At the time, Sam thought it was wrong to break the rules of the project and save Al's marriage. But seeing the pain that Al was going through, he realised that it definitely was something that shouldn't have happened to such a good person, hence became wrong in his mind.
Mirror Image proves to us that God or Time or Fate or Whatever ultimately is not as powerful as Sam makes out in his head. Rather, it's his own choices.
Unless Al meant that since the start of his incarceration as a POW he was there for five years. Which, if Sam didn't make life more difficult for Al, would have meant Al was captured in 1968. Seems reasonable...
Lightning McQueenie said:That, and when he perves on the sexy French lady in Blind Faith
Lightning McQueenie said:The point that was trying to be made is that right and wrong are concepts made up by humans. So what Sam needs to change ultimately depends on his own belief about what is right and wrong. At the time, Sam thought it was wrong to break the rules of the project and save Al's marriage. But seeing the pain that Al was going through, he realised that it definitely was something that shouldn't have happened to such a good person, hence became wrong in his mind.
Mirror Image proves to us that God or Time or Fate or Whatever ultimately is not as powerful as Sam makes out in his head. Rather, it's his own choices.
Lightning McQueenie said:Unless Al meant that since the start of his incarceration as a POW he was there for five years. Which, if Sam didn't make life more difficult for Al, would have meant Al was captured in 1968. Seems reasonable...
Blue_enigma said:Exactly (and as you already know, I'm in the 'it's all Sam' camp).
Blue_enigma said:This is definitely a big part of it, Sam realizing how much pain Al was in and that it was a wrong that did need to be made right. And not just for Al, but Beth too - in the original history, she had to move on with her life and not keep mourning Al forever, but I don't think she ever stopped loving him and I don't think a day went by that she didn't have regrets, especially if she saw Maggie's photo of him and realized that she'd been mistaken.
I know right?! The last time I watched that episode I was like "wait a minute, did he check out her a** as she was walking away!?" XD I'm not sure I'd ever noticed that before.
A very in depth thought but I don't completely agree, not in reference to Quantum Leap.
Now that you have me thinking about that, it's true that whenever Ziggy is pitted against Sam's gut feelings she always loses. So perhaps Sam does at times choose what he changes however there are some conflicts with this. He doesn't choose to leap into to these particular situations, he saw Delilah's innocence in her eyes in So Help Me God but he didn't decide to leap into that courtroom. Usually he doesn't know what the situation is until told.
Here's a brain twister, how was Sam not able to save his father and sister? This says to me that GTFW does have limitations on what is meant to be changed.
Good thought but no. The exact line was:
"What the hell? I get repatriated in five years."
As am I though I do believe that GTFW still plays a role, it just didn't have to be nearly as large of one as Sam had allowed.
This is an excellent point and I believe Beth must have seen the photo as it would have been famous but even in the original history in which the photo did not exist she must have been told I imagine. So in both timelines she did find out that she'd made a huge mistake to give up on Al and probably lived the rest of her life in guilt and shame, which possibly even ruined her marriage to Dirk.
Lightning McQueenie said:Unfortunately we don't know anything about her marriage to Dirk. Judging by how much they were put together in MIA, one might think that Beth and Dirk were meant to be, so they might have been very happy (aside from the obvious guilt about hurting Al). Since we only ever see the story from Al's point of view, we can't say anything for certain. But I think we can all agree that Al didn't deserve what he came back to and after all he did to help Sam help others, it was fitting that he should finally find some happiness.
Lightning McQueenie said:The point I was making is that in the end, he always has a choice to make - he doesn't HAVE to do what Ziggy tells him
As for why he couldn't help his dad or Katie - well his dad was too set in his ways, and had no intention of changing his lifestyle. Sam can't force him to exercise and to eat good food.
As for Katie, love literally makes people blind and deaf to what others think about that person. There's no way she would listen to anyone warning her against Chuck. Again, it was something she had to learn for herself.
Unfortunately we don't know anything about her marriage to Dirk. Judging by how much they were put together in MIA, one might think that Beth and Dirk were meant to be, so they might have been very happy (aside from the obvious guilt about hurting Al). Since we only ever see the story from Al's point of view, we can't say anything for certain.
Agreed that the way Dirk's and Beth's paths would cross were so convenient that they even felt rehearsed, which almost has me wondering if Alia could have played a role. That line he'd cracked about his mother wanting grandchildren seemed way intentional. This is one reason Sam hadn't felt right about pursuing that task.
blue_enigma said:Or Dirk himself was intentionally putting himself in her path. He was very persistent, despite the fact that she had a wedding ring on her finger (yes, she had the M.I.A. bracelet, too, but...). It was clear that she was very vulnerable and to a certain degree he took advantage of that.
blue_enigma said:By the end of the leap, though, I think that changed or Sam would've leaped out as soon as he saved Skaggs' life. He didn't. He hung around long enough to be standing outside of Beth's house with Al - and it's interesting that he took that as a sign that Al was being given a chance to say goodbye to her, not that he was being given the chance to fix things for Al and Beth.
Honestly Alia is more of an entertaining consideration. I could see a lot of Dirk's behavior also having been her acting and it certainly resembles their types of leaps.
As entertaining as the idea of Alia leaping into Dirk is, I have to disagree. Didn't Sam manhandle Dirk while "apprehending" him? There was no quantum magnetic field interference then...
I absolutely ADORE the scene where they're water-skiing with the helicopter.
Me too. It's a lot of fun, and I like how it shows us that side of Tom Beckett. Tom was a good, strong leader of his team, but he also had a sense of humor and fun (I like his banter with Colonel Grimwald after the water-skiing scene too).
Another part I love is when during the first scene in the bar with the squad Sam, in voice over, says, "Tom never talked about what SEALs do off-duty. And after a few hours with BRAVO squad I knew why. Mom would've had a cow." I crack up every time he says that. It's hilarious and so Sam.
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